Old Goat

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Posts by Old Goat

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  33

  Are there people who have returned

  by His Excellency in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  considering all the consequences of leaving the organization (especially the loss of family), some who have already known ttat have decided to return and continue with the flow just to keep their families and friend.. my question is if anyone here had tried it and how they have been managing living a lie constantly day-after-day?, as i am seriously considering returnning back to the full routine..

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  Old Goat

  Label, it happens to me sometimes if I write my comment in Word and past it here. If i use WordPerfect, it never happens. I don't know why this is.
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  33

  Are there people who have returned

  by His Excellency in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  considering all the consequences of leaving the organization (especially the loss of family), some who have already known ttat have decided to return and continue with the flow just to keep their families and friend.. my question is if anyone here had tried it and how they have been managing living a lie constantly day-after-day?, as i am seriously considering returnning back to the full routine..

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  Old Goat

  I attend very irregularly. I have the excuse of bad health and old age. My family are all active except for a brother who walked away decades ago. I keep a low profile. I don't upset my family, especailly my wife. I also don't believe a significant part of Watchtower nonsense. I don't know what to tell you.

  People were upset when I resigned as an elder. I had declining health as a ready made reason. And it was partly the reason. I avoid comments on doctrine, except those I believe. I don't express opinions. I don't answer at meetings much. I have a large extended family to preserve. I occasionally, rather bluntly, tell an elder he's being stupid. But then I've always done that. So they aren't usually shocked by a cranky old man.

  Not everything the Watchtower teaches is wrong. Some is. but not everything. What disturbs me has nothing to do with high behavioral expectations, or past history. I think much of what's said here about Russell's past is wrong. I taught history at the university level. What's said here would get a huge red-letter F. (not always, but often). I'm disturbed by abuse of power. I'm distrubed by a tendency to put personal opinion in place of scripture. I don't like bad research or poor writing. The Watchtower had been guilty of both since before I was exposed to it.

  We don't teach Logic in lower grades anymore. We should. The governing body should be made to take a course in Logic. I often link to the truth history blog. They're really competent historians. One of the owners sent me off to research Isaac Watts view of the trinity. It was interesting. But more interesting to me was his book on logic. Logic is rare in Watchtower culture.

  I wish i had a solution for you. I don't.
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  18

  Trivia about the history of the beloved Governing Body

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the very first legal governing body of (jehovah's witnesses) bible students were seven persons which included pastor c.t.russell, his wife maria, and his controversial ward, rose ball.. five men and two women.

  these seven persons were also the directors of the watchtower bible and tract society.

  this group set policies and practices for the rest of the religious followers of pastor russell.

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  Old Goat

  Nathan as I recall it they were using the large wall charts when I was baptized (1948). They used them up to 1967 I think, switiching to a small paper chart for the information board. They dropped that soon thereafter. I'm going by memory here. As you can see from my baptismal date, I'm getting a bit old. My memory isn't all that good sometimes.

  As I remember it, there is a photo of a hall showing the chart in a Consolation magazine. I didn't go looking for it. But I might later.
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  18

  Trivia about the history of the beloved Governing Body

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the very first legal governing body of (jehovah's witnesses) bible students were seven persons which included pastor c.t.russell, his wife maria, and his controversial ward, rose ball.. five men and two women.

  these seven persons were also the directors of the watchtower bible and tract society.

  this group set policies and practices for the rest of the religious followers of pastor russell.

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  Old Goat

  I remember the "sales charts" that used to hang in the front of the Hall, with a month by month report on hours, "back calls" and various placements and number of bible studies. It was a very "sales" oriented culture. I don't see the apostles keeping charts.
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  10

  Is WTBTS really imitating the first century apostles? Or could they just be copying something far closer to home?

  by likeabird in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the borg likes to go on about how everything they do is in imitation of first century apostles.. .

  that's what i usually asked myself.

  i just couldn't imagine the apostles having to lug a heavy bag of literature door to door like we did.

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  Old Goat

  Russell was all cut and past. Even the ads for his books and speaches are 'borrowed' from his contemporaries. A few of the Russellite ads are here: http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/
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  32

  Flashback to the sixties Seatle

  by Tater-T in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so while making a you tube video of my dad today, i came across this in a dvd of home movies from way back, i didn't even know about it... originally shot on super 8 film, shot off screen with camcorder in 1992, with open mic, transfered to dvd in 2010 .. made to you tube in 2013.... check out the food service, without paper plates no less .. it's only a couple minutes on convention then, a little seatle conventions were a family vacation when we were growing up ... .

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teslivkoak4.

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  Old Goat

  I sound like someone with ethics. you don't.
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  32

  Flashback to the sixties Seatle

  by Tater-T in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so while making a you tube video of my dad today, i came across this in a dvd of home movies from way back, i didn't even know about it... originally shot on super 8 film, shot off screen with camcorder in 1992, with open mic, transfered to dvd in 2010 .. made to you tube in 2013.... check out the food service, without paper plates no less .. it's only a couple minutes on convention then, a little seatle conventions were a family vacation when we were growing up ... .

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teslivkoak4.

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  Old Goat

  How so? because without checking you presumed someone lied. In this case, they didn't. This happened at the International Convention in 1953. There are photos. Besides, I was there. (I'm a really cranky old guy now). I saw it. Good practice is to check before you speak, type or text.
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  32

  Flashback to the sixties Seatle

  by Tater-T in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so while making a you tube video of my dad today, i came across this in a dvd of home movies from way back, i didn't even know about it... originally shot on super 8 film, shot off screen with camcorder in 1992, with open mic, transfered to dvd in 2010 .. made to you tube in 2013.... check out the food service, without paper plates no less .. it's only a couple minutes on convention then, a little seatle conventions were a family vacation when we were growing up ... .

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teslivkoak4.

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  Old Goat

  It was the navy and civil defence. the convention was in New York City. Photos are in the convention reports and I was there to see it. Isn't it a bit nasty to presume someone made up the story?
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  32

  Flashback to the sixties Seatle

  by Tater-T in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so while making a you tube video of my dad today, i came across this in a dvd of home movies from way back, i didn't even know about it... originally shot on super 8 film, shot off screen with camcorder in 1992, with open mic, transfered to dvd in 2010 .. made to you tube in 2013.... check out the food service, without paper plates no less .. it's only a couple minutes on convention then, a little seatle conventions were a family vacation when we were growing up ... .

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teslivkoak4.

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  Old Goat

  This seems to be the Men of Goodwill District Assembly at Sick's Seattle Stadium, July 16-19, 1970. I remember it well.

  I'm fairly certain that I shouldn't tell you too much about it, because most anything I have to say would be identifying. I will say that some of my best work at convention experiences happened here. And a "brother" who was a reporter for a local station made me laugh when he scolded a visiting camera man and reporter who worked under him, telling them he'd take up their behavior (which was rude to say the least) back at the station. It is always fun to see a jerk pulled up by his shorts.
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  6

  Sample Pages

  by Old Goat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this is a follow up to my last post about the history written by schulz and de vienne.

  they've posted sample pages from their forth coming book on their blog.

  http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

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  Old Goat

  One of the authors has posted an essay about their fothcoming book. Fun read, interesting:

  http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/